You need to persevere. As you described, he doesn't need that feed but he is used to having you there and has to learn that he doesn't need to.

Decide in advance of the night whether your method is to go cold turkey on that feed. In which case, stick with one method - decide in advance which one you are going to use and keep to that and don't chop and change from night to night either. If picking him up makes him worse, leave him lying in the cot and shush/pat him when you would have been doing the pick up and take your hand away, stop the shush when you would have been putting him back down.

Alternatively, give him a feed provided it isn't less than four hours from the last one (if you are not doing a DF as such) and shorten it by a minute a night and then use your chosen settling method if you need to. In a week he will have no feed. You might still have to do a bit of settling but the feed will have gone and then if you are consistent you will then soon find you don't have to settle him either.

As ever, don't go to him straight away and keep interactions to the minimum.

Let us know how last night / tonight went

reply by DT-Elisabeth - 5 weeks ago

The last few nights I've had him screaming for an hour and a half and have given in. Night before last he woke at 1.30 and I just fed him straight away as so tired hoping he'd go til / but instead he was screeching again at 5am. last night wasn't great either. He started complaining at 12:40 and at 2am I gave in and fed him. I'm so upset withmyself as i wish I'd just fed him straight away all the times so that he'd do his 11-6 stretch again but I've now only confused the matter and fear he'll not do it again. When. Do feed him he goes back down awake and can self settle just fine. So upset with myself. Now I have a confused babe and no energy and am so tired from being up for 2 hrs with him during nights rather than just feeding. I hope he goes back t an 11-6 soon! If I am giving in to one night feed between 7pm and 6am Should I just feed him as soon as he starts complaining in the night in the hope that he brings it back from 1am to 11pm?

reply by Noah2010 - 5 weeks ago

Hi, after his bedtime feed, see when he wakes and providing this is at least 4 hrs after his last feed do this as the night feed and then stick to this time each night so that Noah gets used to this as his routine and only feed him the once during the night as he will keep waking for a feed if one is given. It will be tough but only for the first few nights and will be worth it. Keep us posted.

reply by DT-emily - 4 weeks ago

So the night that you suggested this he did 7pm and woke at 3:20. I fed him and then he woke at 6:30 and I got him up and fed him again. Last night he woke at 1:50 and I tried to stretch til 3 but by 2:30 was exhausted. It was a bit of a 'mantra' cry again, not screeching, so I am getting really confused as to whether he is genuinely hungry or not. He just about fed for 10 mins, with coaxing from me to stay awake and then he went back down, awake, and settled himself until 7am. He then fed for 10mins and threw up....don't know if that's reflux or he was just still full from the night?! I'm just confused now and just wonder does he need the feed.if he doesn't, how am I a prop if he can self-settle at bedtime, nap time and any other time? As elizabeth and wendy suggested, the one minite shortening might help me figure out if he needs the feed but because I am tired already I'm just nervous about cutting down the feed and him waking again 2 hrs later in the wee hours ya know?! If he does need the feed, is it worth me tryong a df again on him (I tried it at 8-10 weeks but it caused him to wake more often during the night than without).
Thanks for your help, am feeling like I can't figure out my little one!

reply by Noah2010 - 4 weeks ago

Ps- noah was weighed yesterday and is a hearty 15lb (6.8kg) at 14 weeks .... Should he be able to go through the night based on weight? Or do bigger babes need more feeding?!

reply by Noah2010 - 4 weeks ago

Bless him he's a big chap & absolutely gorgeous in his photo! He's still very young & if he's totally BF (I THINK he is from your posts) it's very likely he still needs one night feed.

As he's not used to having a DF it would be better to opt for a middle of the night feed at 1.30am or later. If he wakes before then, try & settle him back to sleep but if it's 1.30am or later, feed him then try not to feed again until 6am or later which will be his first feed of the day.

By doing that, you're not feeding every time he wakes so the feeding isn't a prop & hopefully you'll avoid prolonged periods of PUPDCD when you're already exhausted.

Give it a go for a couple of nights & let us know how you get on.

reply by Mentor-Sarah - 4 weeks ago

thanks for this yes he is exclusively breastfed. 3 nights ago he did 7pm -6am but he had a temp during hte day form immunisations so i think it was a one off. he had a HUGE 25 min feed at 6am. since that one off he's been waking around 3am. last night i fed him for 6 minutes and he slept til 6:30am when he had a 10/12 min feed.
but something else seems to have unclicked now as well....
he settles himself ok for naps in prams and often puts himself off to sleep now after 2 hrs of being awake. however, in the last few days he's started waking form his late afternoon nap really grumpy. he goes down at 4.30 and wakes at 5:15. i have some chilled out mat time and tummy time, then i do first half of split feed at 6pm, bath, massage etc and at 6:30-6:45 we are in the bedroom and i top up his feed. so we're fine up to this point...but as SOON as i have burped him and he hits the mattress he starts crying. last night it took 1.5 hrs of pupdcd. tonight 1 hr. it's almost like he's over tired, but i dont understand as he used to do this just fine and settle yes with a bit of a moan but not a full on tantrum. i'm wondering if he's teething...but even so....that wouldn't explain why it's as soon as he hits mattress? any ideas? has he become overtired even though he used to be able to do this final stretch of the day just fine?

reply by Noah2010 - 4 weeks ago

The nights are looking ok. The bedtime may well just be a phase. Switch to pupdcd with 10 minutes of cd, 10 minutes of pupd and so on if you have not already done so. Let us know what happened last night.

reply by Mentor-Wendy - 4 weeks ago

Last night he woke at 11:30 wanting food so I fed him in the hope he'd go to 6 but I guess that was a wrong move. At 4:40am he was awake. I did pupdcd til 6am, got him up , fed him and he still only took 15 mins so not ravenous! He had a 2 hour nap this morning at 8:30am which is v unlike him. He usually does 45 or and hour. He had another 2 hrs this arvo until 2:15. He fed, then by 3:30 he was barely awake? Again, v odd! I managed to keep him entertained unttil 4 thinking he'd have a nice hour nap before bathtime but at 4:30 he was up and screeeeeeaming for food. So I fed him at 5, but he only took 5/6 mins. Then he slept again from 6-6:15 and I did bath etc and in bed by half 7 with a feed at 7:15. He went down fine but 45 mins later he woke and I've been trying to get him back down but again he seemed ravenous so I have just fed him (9pm but only took 4/5mins before falling asleep so I took him off boob) and he went down grumbling and awake but he's drifting off now.
Totally feels like I'm going backwards. He was on such a great routine? What's going on?!

reply by Noah2010 - 4 weeks ago

Is Noah settling any better now? My little'un similar age (2nd May) and I'm struggling at night too! Wakes half 2 for a feed, again at 5ish - for the past week I've been giving him a dummy at 5am, I don't want to go down this route (I'd like him to self settle), reason why I've joined up! He's not really hungry at 7am, so I know it's all down to habit now.

Anyway, my DS wouldn't settle at nap times and a few weeks ago I put a turned inside out t-shirt in his cot (wedged into the bars) and since then he's settled really quickly without any fuss (probably smell has knocked him out!). If he still isn't I'd recommend trying that.

Good luck - he's to us having another night of broken sleep!

reply by sleepy7751 - 4 weeks ago

He has gone backwards a bit, so you need to get a bit more consistency in the following areas:

1. Make sure he is settling himself to sleep at bedtime and for naps.

2. Stick with 3.5-4 hourly feeding routine through the day.

3. Don't let him nap after 5pm. He can go to bed from 6:30pm.

4. Aim for only 1 feed between bedtime and 6am.

How did last night go?

reply by Mentor-Wendy - 4 weeks ago

Last nightwas back to square one! He woke at 12am and fed for a huge 20 mins. Settle himself after that to sleep until 3:30am. I stretched til 4 and again he had a huge 20 min feed.I slept in this morning until 7:45 and he wasn't whinging yet for food....shall I revert back to 3 hrly during day? How does that work with 2 hour awake times-do I wake him after an hour nap? Thanks for your help!

reply by Noah2010 - 4 weeks ago

I should add, whilst he wasn't screeching for food this morning he's had a good 20minute breakfast! So is this genuine hunger? Growth spurt? Time to wean (surely not at 15 weeks?!)

reply by Noah2010 - 4 weeks ago

don't revert back to 3Hrs now he's shown he can manage the 4 stick with it this will help him get to going longer through the night. Keep consistent with it and you will notice him taking more if he is having a spurt. Have a word with your HV about weaning if you feel he may need it and they will advise you and check his weight etc.

reply by DT-emily - 3 weeks ago

So he's teething, which is what the sreaming is we've discovered. I didn't think that was possible at 15 weeks but apparently so. Any tips on how to handle routines when they are in so much pain?! Last night I tried a new strategy....rather than wait until he was almost nodding off and putting him down, I had the blinds slightly open, gave him a 5min top up feed, then burped and read a book to him and put him in crib 20 mins earlier than I normally would. I sat on the bed out of site reading my book and he babbled then settle himself in about 15 mins so right on schedj! And he didn't do his normal waking and screaming after 45 mins either. I've tried the same approach tonight so fingers crossed. He did wake hungry and 12:30am last night though and I stretched him until 2am. He fed for 7 mins then re-settled and woke at 6:30am! So I hope we will have something similar again. It's just when he wakes in pain I find it heartbreaking. The other 2 night we were doing pupdcd for 2 hrs and he wouldn't be calmed during the pu! He just kept screeching! Eventually he tired himself out but then woke 2 hrs later and it all started again. But then he slept until 5:30am so he had gone from 7pm-5:30am without food. Do I take that as a cue to drop nightfeed or say that was a one off owing to him just tiring himself out?
Also, When he's teething am I right to still stick to 1 nightfeed?

reply by Noah2010 - 3 weeks ago

He will be teething now for the next year and a half so although it is hard when they are suffering, it is best to stick to the routine as best you can. I've always given calpol after the last feed before bedtime and again in the night if there are any wakings and I can't praise Nelsons teething granules enough, my son (Noah) opens his mouth for these as though he knows they will make him better. See how you go on but it sounds like you are doing really well and making great progress!

reply by DT-emily - 3 weeks ago

sorry I forgot to answer your question about the night feed, he is at the age now to go through without a night feed so yes look at dropping this now. Good luck!

reply by DT-emily - 3 weeks ago

Excellent choice of name :-)
I can't seem to find any nelsons in boots, any ideas?
The last 2 nights I've given him a dose of ibuprofen before bed and he's slept from7pm to 6am?!!?? I'm nit sure if its the nurofen or if he has dropped his nightfeeds on his own..? But of course I wake up at 3am with killer boobache! Do I now assume he doesn't need to eat during night? If he does start waking do I assume it's genuine hunger/thirst or do I not feed him now at all between 7pm and 6am? Even during a growth spurt?

reply by Noah2010 - 3 weeks ago

If he is going through the night then he no longer needs a night feed. If he starts waking in a few weeks then he may be ready to be weaned. Alternatively, increase the length of each feed through the day. Sorry I can't help with where to get the teething powders.

reply by DT-Jenny - 3 weeks ago

so he did 7-6 for 4 nights then did 7-4am, fed, then slept til 7 - big feed at 7am so i do think he was hungry.
last night he did 7-1am and 1am-6am.
he doesn't cry for food anymore, he 'asks' using coos and gurgles, so i do think this was genuine hunger - he took both sides at 1am and a full feed at 6am....
might this be a 16 week growth spurt? should i go back to clustering at 5pm and 7pm? i'm loathe to introduce a dream feed at this stage as it made him wake more often at 8 weeks old.
i can't relaly feed him longer during the day - he feeds for as long as he wants but is a reflux babe and overeats so i need up with ALOT of sick on me!
i'm also feeling very overwhelmed by it all. i get stressed when he doesn't nap long enough as he is then tired for rest of day and bedtime becomes a mare. and i dread going to sleep myself as i dont know what the night will bring. someone just tell me i'll get used to it!?

reply by Noah2010 - 2 weeks ago

If he is having a growth spurt then you really need to increase the amount of milk that he takes through the day. However, if you are convinced that he is hungry at night (and it doesn't sound like he is starving or he wouldn't be cooing), then just stick with the 1 feed. If his reflux is not under control with medication then go back to the doctors. You can try the cluster feeds at 5 and 7 to see if it makes any difference.

reply by Mentor-Wendy - 2 weeks ago

So since my last post noah has been bringing his nightfeed earlier and earlier. It's gone from 4am to 2am to 1am to 12am to 11:30pm and tonight he started whining at 10:30pm having had a huge feed at 7pm. I tried pupd but he was losing it and clearly hungry so I fed him after an hour, so 11:30pm. He took both sides and is now settling himself back to sleep. I really hope he doesn't wake every 4 hrs or wake in the early hrs for a feed!
What would you sggest I do? Go with his flow and keep giving this 'dream feed' feed that he seems to have introduced for himself and if he wakes in the night not feed him? Or should or stretch the df out past 1am if poss so that it's more likely he doesn't wake again in the night? He was weighed again today and whilst he's still putting onm weight he's dropped under the percentile that he was on so health vis just said keep an eye on it. I'm just aware now that perhaps if he's asking for food at all I should give it to help him maintain his weight?

reply by Noah2010 - 13 days ago

Tell us how he went on through the night last night after the 10pm feed. I wouldn't recommend you introduce yourself as a prop through the night to feed every time he wakes, if you feel he needs a night feed still and you're worried he isn't getting enough through the day, tank him up in the early evening and stick to one feed through the night that is at least 4hrs since the last feed.

reply by DT-emily - 13 days ago

his feed last night was at 11:30 in the end as i did pupd for an hour before figuring he was actually v hungry. he took both sides and slept until 5:45 - then chattered and did a bit of a mantra call until 6:30 and fell back asleep. i got him up at 7:15am .So should i feed him straight away tonight even if he wakes at 10:30 for it?

reply by Noah2010 - 13 days ago

Well it looks like he did better last night, try and keep the feeds 4 hrs apart, so if he's fed at 7pm tonight, don't feed again until after 11pm and then 4am if he wakes for it then if not try and wait until after 6am.

reply by DT-emily - 12 days ago

Last night he had bedtine feed at 6:30 becuase he woke early from his catnap. Asleep by 7pm. Then woke at 10 'calling' but not crying for food but I stretched until 10:30 when it turned into crying. Then he woke at 3:30am. BUt just grumbled then fell back to sleep, and he's woken at 5:30 this morning chatting to himself. I'll get him up at 6:15 though as I'm trying to get him to wake at 7am as 6 is just too harsh-am I right to try and extend his wake up time? And should his bedtime be the same time everynight? Or as I do now and have it depenedent on when he wakes from his afternoon catnap between 4 and 5pm? How long should I expect him to 'sleep' for eventually?

reply by Noah2010 - 10 days ago

You are doing the right thing extending his mornings, it takes a while to see a difference but stick with it. Try and stick to a bedtime routine but half an hour either side won't make a lot of difference.

reply by DT-emily - 10 days ago

One qyuck question-when I extend mornings am I spposed to put him down for nap 15 mins later too?

reply by Noah2010 - 10 days ago

sorry I don't understand your question, do you mean put him down for his naps 15 mins later than the usual time he has them if he gets up later in the mornings?

reply by DT-emily - 9 days ago

sorry i am unclear! yes, that's what i mean so for example if he wakes at 6 but i am trying to extend him 15 minutes, igot him up at 6:15 - do i then put him down at 8:15am for morning nap rather than 8am?
thanks

reply by Noah2010 - 9 days ago